Two CD drives stopped reading CDs at the same time. \ VOGONS

Two CD drives stopped reading CDs at the same time.

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First post, by xtv

Posted on 2024-07-06, 13:34

xtv Offline

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Hi all,

After being a Vogons reader for quite some time (this forum is amazing!), it came the time for my first post. I believe I'm following all the rules, please forgive me if I've missed something.

I have two IDE CD drives that I was hoping to use on my retro PC build, one being a Sony CDU-5211, which was barely used, and the second a HP CD-RW 9300 that I bought a new old stock on ebay. Both were working 100% the last time I've played with them. I even tested the HP to burn a couple of CD-Rs in low speed, which worked fine.

Now this time I tried using a USB to IDE adapter on my modern PC to burn a windows 98 ISO with the HP drive, and it suddenly wouldn't read any CDs anymore. I then swapped to the Sony CD-ROM, same behavior.

Tried a couple of pressed CDs, one Linux installation CD-R that I know to have been burned properly, a few cd-rw, nothing! For both drives it behaves as it loads the tray empty, won't even try/struggle to read it. Led blinks a couple of times and it gives up.

Now I tried both these drives on my retro PC (a socket 370 Motherboard with celeron mendocino) with native IDE and Ms-Dos 6.22 installed. Both get detected by Bios, but same behavior, won't read anything. MSCDEX set the drive up, when I do a D: and DIR, I get the fail/retry/abort dialog as if there's no CD in.

Now I replaced the motherboard for a second socket 370 motherboard; exact same behavior above!
have replaced IDE cables, no luck.

I'm really intrigued, how can possibly be the two drives 'dying' at the same time? The HP is brand new, haven't used it 10 times.

Does anyone have any suggestions? At this point I'm clueless.
Could the USB to IDE adapter have killed both drives data transfer ability, even though they get detected in BIOS?

PS, I've used an external ATX psu to power these drives when using the usb to IDE adapter (not the same inside my modern pc). I'm thinking, could the IDE and power rail grounds inside the drive not be connected and that caused a high potential difference in the ide data and have burned the drive, whilst it still gets detected by the bios?

Could one of the CDs I've tried have permanently damaged both drives? Never seen this before, but at this point I'm not discarding anything.

Any ideas to try? I'm pretty frustrated to have likely killed this new old stock HP drive already ☹️

Thanks everyone.

Reply 1 of 17, by xtv

Posted on 2024-07-07, 13:36

xtv Offline

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Update on this one, I've got two other drives to test with the motherboard and they're working perfectly fine.
My only conclusion is that the usb to IDE somehow fried my drives!
Beware of this adapter!! https://i.postimg.cc/pdPf2BV8/IMG-20240707-143006.jpg

Reply 2 of 17, by rasz_pl

Posted on 2024-07-07, 14:08

rasz_pl Offline

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does it allow plugging the cable upside down?

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https://github.com/raszpl/386RC-16 memory board
https://github.com/raszpl/440BX Reference Design adapted to Kicad
https://github.com/raszpl/Zenith_ZBIOS MFM-300 Monitor

Reply 3 of 17, by devius

Posted on 2024-07-07, 14:29

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xtv wrote on 2024-07-07, 13:36:

My only conclusion is that the usb to IDE somehow fried my drives!

Did you also connect these to the external ATX PSU?

Reply 4 of 17, by ux-3

Posted on 2024-07-07, 17:15

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Check if all pins are still at full length in the drives.

Used master/slave/select settings correctly?

Checked voltages on PSU?

Retro PC warning: The things you own end up owning you.

Reply 5 of 17, by Joakim

Posted on 2024-07-07, 17:29

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Tried a different IDE cable?

Last edited by Joakim on 2024-07-08, 05:56. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 6 of 17, by RandomStranger

Posted on 2024-07-07, 17:44

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Experienced something weirder. A few years ago 3 or 4 of my drives stopped reading CDs at the same time. The DVD combo drives still read DVDs, but not CDs.

Reply 7 of 17, by kotel

Posted on 2024-07-07, 18:05

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Open them up and see if there's any obvious damage.

"All my efforts were in vain...
Let that be my disappointment."
-Kotel

Reply 8 of 17, by xtv

Posted on 2024-07-10, 04:17

xtv Offline

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rasz_pl wrote on 2024-07-07, 14:08:

does it allow plugging the cable upside down?

No, the cables have that dent that won't allow connect inverted. Plus the drives are being listed, I can for instance eject and load the cd over software. It just won't read anything.

Reply 9 of 17, by xtv

Posted on 2024-07-10, 04:24

xtv Offline

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devius wrote on 2024-07-07, 14:29:

xtv wrote on 2024-07-07, 13:36:

My only conclusion is that the usb to IDE somehow fried my drives!

Did you also connect these to the external ATX PSU?

Yes, that same atx psu is the one I'm using to power the entire retro system (socket 370 Mobo & drives).
I just didn't connect the drives to the usb-ide adapter this time (which I plugged to my i7 desktop before)

Reply 10 of 17, by xtv

Posted on 2024-07-10, 04:34

xtv Offline

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kotel wrote on 2024-07-07, 18:05:

Open them up and see if there's any obvious damage.

I did, nothing obvious. I would be surprised to see a flex cable disconnected on both drives at the same time, but I did open both drives to see, as they really seem to be gone.

The Sony CD-ROM is just a standard rebranded lite on.
But the HP CD-RW is a actually a Sony branded board. It's so well built internally, has discrete Sony microchips, buffer memory, ferrite rings around the flex cables, foam under the cover, everything tidly put together.. Shame to bin this unit

Reply 11 of 17, by xtv

Posted on 2024-07-10, 04:39

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RandomStranger wrote on 2024-07-07, 17:44:

Experienced something weirder. A few years ago 3 or 4 of my drives stopped reading CDs at the same time. The DVD combo drives still read DVDs, but not CDs.

I had a original Nero installation CD that came with that Sony drive. Obviously somebody put it in the box by mistake, as that drive is a standard CD-ROM, not writer. That cd is weird, I remember trying to read it from the CD-ROM in the past, and it detected the data tracks as audio.
I tried to read it on both drives. I don't know it that could possibly damage both driver's laser units, just by reading a CD.
That's the only other explanation I have, but didn't even mention before as I've never seen this happening.

Reply 12 of 17, by ux-3

Posted on 2024-07-10, 07:35

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Cleaned the lenses?

Most cases where a drive of mine stopped reading could be fixed by just cleaning the lens.

Last edited by ux-3 on 2024-07-10, 08:42. Edited 1 time in total.

Retro PC warning: The things you own end up owning you.

Reply 13 of 17, by kotel

Posted on 2024-07-10, 07:38

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When you insert a CD, does the spindle try to start, but fails? Or is it not doing anything? Had an similar issue with my HP DVD ROM drive. Its spindle tried to spin, and the lens tried to read, but it was giving up. Its behavior changed when I was applying pressure to the motor controller.

"All my efforts were in vain...
Let that be my disappointment."
-Kotel

Reply 14 of 17, by xtv

Posted on 2024-07-10, 18:51

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ux-3 wrote on 2024-07-10, 07:35:

Cleaned the lenses?

Most cases where a drive of mine stopped reading could be fixed by just cleaning the lens.

I did yeah, when I opened these drives I gently scrubbed a piece of cotton on top of the lenses.
Didn't help.

Reply 15 of 17, by xtv

Posted on 2024-07-10, 18:54

xtv Offline

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kotel wrote on 2024-07-10, 07:38:

When you insert a CD, does the spindle try to start, but fails? Or is it not doing anything? Had an similar issue with my HP DVD ROM drive. Its spindle tried to spin, and the lens tried to read, but it was giving up. Its behavior changed when I was applying pressure to the motor controller.

It does spin the cd briefly yes. It gives up very quickly though. K3B, the Linux cd burner software detects the drive, I can eject and load the tray from it, but it shows as empty (no CD) in drive at all times. If I try to mount it manually, same, get no media loaded, something like that.

Reply 16 of 17, by ux-3

Posted on 2024-07-10, 21:26

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When I have a drive that stops reading completely, I try a q-tip with pure alcohol. Dry cleaning often didn't cut it. Just be gentle, you don't want to scratch the lens.

Retro PC warning: The things you own end up owning you.

Reply 17 of 17, by devius

Posted on 2024-07-10, 21:32

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From the symptoms it looks like the laser has given up the ghost. Both at the same time is rare, but not impossible, and could have nothing to do with the USB to IDE adapter.

It may still be possible to adjust the laser focus or power to try to extract a little bit more life out of them. This is done with a small trimpot somewhere in the controller board close to where the cable from the laser connects, or in the laser assembly itself. Also I once also solved a problem where a CD-RW wasn't reading CDs reliably any more by just reflashing its firmware again.

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