VOGONS


First post, by BitWrangler

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Hi Vogons,

So hopefully my "office" room is on track and I've been figuring which systems to home in it. One of which under consideration is an AST Advantage! 386SX/25 ... plain Jane edition. But in 1992 a few months after MPC level 1 was finalised, AST announced...
https://techmonitor.ai/technology/ast_has_the … 5_multimedia_pc

May 31, 1992
AST HAS THE ADVANTAGE! 386SX/25 MULTIMEDIA PC
By CBR Staff Writer

AST Research Inc has come out with the Advantage! 386SX/25 Multimedia personal computer, which is built around the Advanced Micro Devices Inc Am386 chip and includes CD-ROM disk drive, multimedia audio board, Super VGA monitor, stereo speakers, microphone and collection of popular multimedia CD-ROM programs; it has 80Mb disk; no price was given.

and it got another mention here ... https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1992- … -656-story.html

But nothing much else is turning up about AST Multimedia machines until 486SX/25 varieties were on sale in 1993 and then the bandwagon really got going with MPC L2 and everybody and their dog put out Multimedia PCs.

So aside from announcement, I've not come across anything to confirm the 386 MMPC got out into the wild. I also have nothing so far on what Soundcard, Speakers, CDROM and the software package was. Other than of course assuming it was MPC-1 spec "22khz sound, single speed CD". So at the moment I am not overwhelmingly certain that this actually reached sales status, maybe they held off to release the 486 version. Assuming it existed, it was quite likely based on the 386SX/25 model with CDROM and sound fitted.

Not sure where ASTs advertising budget went in 1992 and 1993, not finding the glossy ads that might give clues in "the usual suspects" i.e. what google books has for 1990s mags.

Does anyone have any knowledge of such a machine, or know where clues may be found?

thanks,

BitWrangler.

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 1 of 8, by BitWrangler

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Ah, we have a review from late '92, page 24 of the pdf..
https://www.commodore.ca/gallery/magazines/co … pute-147-01.pdf
Which I am not convinced that the picture shows a Matsushita drive, IDK just never seen one looking like that. The following page states that it's a Creative Labs soundblaster multimedia upgrade kit with SBPro, Matsu 1x drive, Labtec speakers and mic.

Edit: Ohhh, it's the cartridge load one https://twitter.com/RetroSpector78/status/134 … 899492772605952

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 2 of 8, by Irinikus

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Here's a picture of what appears to be an AST Advantage 386SX/25: (Not the multimedia variant though!)

4FxYsC5.png

YouTube

Reply 3 of 8, by BitWrangler

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Thanks, yes, know that machine exists, got one, the Multimedia version though, did it make it to stores?? That article above reviews one, but that's not conclusive, and since it appears to just use a Creative Labs Multimedia Kit, then it raises the question of was it factory made or dealer installed to shift 386SX/25s

Edit: So I am thinking I need to scrape together a CT-1600, a CR-563-B, and Labtec speakers... I have a CT-1600, I am fairly sure about some Labtecs being around somwhere, but a cat might have chewed the cord so maybe need repair. Now a 563B I am unlikely to have since I said I didn't see one, but they look different, like a gaping 5.25 with the caddy out, so there's a faint chance there's one around with the caddy inserted that didn't fire a neuron on recognition. I have probably been ignoring anything less than 4x for decades so may be in box of forgotten CDROMs. I should have an alternative mitsu interface drive to substitute though, I ain't looking to spend $100 on the exact right drive.

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 4 of 8, by H3nrik V!

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Wow, I'm just surprised that the term "Multimedia PC" existed on 386SX platform. Didn't believe it was a thing until 486 was the "go-to" system ... 😀

[EDIT] The article in above link actually shows the "MPC" or "Multimedia PC" standard - stating that 386sx with 2MiB of extended memory ... Wow!

If it's dual it's kind of cool ... 😎

--- GA586DX --- P2B-DS --- BP6 ---

Please use the "quote" option if asking questions to what I write - it will really up the chances of me noticing 😀

Reply 5 of 8, by BitWrangler

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Yes, MPC2 was the popular version for later 486es, peak multimedia mindshare saturation. People never remember MPC original, referred to as MPC 1 or MPC level 1 subsequently. Nobody seemed to care about MPC3 either. PC97 etc was more influential.

Dug up a snippet from a footnote of a tech bulletin...
https://www.minuszerodegrees.net/manuals/AST/ … AST_SB_0160.TXT

NOTE: Early MPC machines sold by AST were configured with a Sound
Blaster card and either a CDU-31A-01 or -02 CD-ROM drive. These
drives are not Dual-Speed drives. This updated driver DOES NOT
make a Sony Single-Speed drive into a Dual-Speed drive.

So those Sony drives may also be correct to original multimedia models. I believe I may have one.

I'm still thinking about the "real model" thing though.... December issue of Compute! gets one for review, announced at end of May. Assuming mag was being printed/distributed mid November, and had standard for the time 2 month lead time, that takes us back to mid Sep for when the article had to be ready. That means the reviewer probably wanted the machine a month before that, mid August.... and according to the review AST were "scrambling" to get a review system together and forgot the disks. Scrambling for machine they said they had 2.5 months prior. This year though, AST where promoting their new 486 and the entire lineup was 486 in 1993, I'm still thinking that these 386sx/25 were sitting already made, in distributor or dealer hands, when announcement was made, but they didn't have the MPC package yet, just a back up of sx25s. So seeing it in my head like AST has to call back an sx25 from a warehouse, apply the Creative MPC upgrade kit and sent it out for the review.

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 6 of 8, by BitWrangler

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Aw man, the thick plottens, AST didn't know what they were doing either 🤣

From page 49 of the pdf (BIG, 56k beware 🤣 ) page 45 of print ver... https://vintageapple.org/pcworld/pdf/PC_World … August_1992.pdf

Garage Sale Today: Three-Legged Chips
R etractions are painful, but here goes.
In July you witnessed
me getting just a little breathless over the
prospect of a then-unreleased 486SX-based multimedia PC from AST
that would drive the multimedia dollar premium
down into the 300s.
But, a few days before
introduction, AST decided that folks would rather
have a 386SX/25-based
system with a big hardware -software bundle for about the
same $900 everyone else is charging. Sorry. Can't blame AST
for the announcement miscue. I'm very pushy, and it's a r ar e
company whose product is truly set before my monthly deadline. But a spate of recent 386 introductions from major vendors convinces me there's a cautionary tale that needs spinnin'.
It seems t he industry is having a garage sale. You know
about garage sales. That's where you push youT Total Junk (as
opposed to yom Still Closet-Worthy Junk ) out into the driveway and stare in wonder as muumuu-clad women and men
whose T-shirts will never again see their belt buckles pay a
quarter here, a buck there, to haul it away for you.

Still digging through PC World they had AST advertising so I am hoping to find SOME indication of this machine's market presence. Finding it faintly hilarious that I'm digging old magazine info about this out of Commodore, Atari and now Apple focused sites.

Edit: haha yeah, AST didn't know what it was doing, very turbulent summer for them. We learn in August that Compaq has started a price war on clones for 486 desktop dominance. So pretty much we have to thank Compaq for bringing in the 486 era as most people know it from '93 instead of them remaining elite machines that home users couldn't really afford, for another year or two. So in September AST's situation is this, page 98 of pdf p.p.90 (BIG) https://vintageapple.org/pcworld/pdf/PC_World … 9_Sept_1992.pdf big shakeups in the market, so I think between announcing the 386sx MPC and getting it out there, this machine was lost in the turmoil of the brewing 486 war, and marketting was de-emphasised, I guess they just cleared them out to discounters, had promotions with their retailers. Tandy/RadioShack didn't seem to go full AST until 1993, their fliers I am finding from 1992 still had the Tandy machines front and center, no mention of other PC brands.

Edit2: it gets picked up in the Multimedia PC buyers guide in the October issue, probably 3 months stale info, notably has it down as an SX20 there, pdf pages 269, 270, 271 (BIG) https://vintageapple.org/pcworld/pdf/PC_World … ctober_1992.pdf That comes across as the inaugural MPC buyers guide, and was kind of a supplement in the magazine that may have been removed from other scanned copies from other months, so not sure if it cycles monthly, or they do alternating notebook/desktop/workstation guides at that time. So when another MPC guide is found it will be interesting to see if it's still in there.

Edit3: Trail seems to have gone cold in PC Worlds, might start with Computer Shopper, eyeballing all the 92/93 issues. One thing I am finding is that AST had no consistency AT ALL when referring to their Advantage systems (And it didn't help they have advantage named products stretching back to mid 80s with their memory boards etc) and the officially AST Advantage! 386SX/25 may be named without the exclamation, or just as Adv! or as 3/25s or many other ways of shortening it.

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 7 of 8, by BitWrangler

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Twice in the text of the Compute! review it says it comes with Labtec CS-150 speakers. I have found my Labtec CS-150 but they look different from those in that one single review picture. They are identical to every image google has of a CS-150 though, so I don't know if we are dealing with a review pic that doesn't have the "right" speakers or a typo. Another source just says it comes "with speakers".

Many things about this config are like a greased marble, the harder you try to put your finger on it, the more it slips away. Not sure where I got CR-563B from above, just that it was a Creative kit inclusion later or what, or the one I most expected to find. I do have one lined up, not sure it works yet. However it is 2x speed so possibly inauthentic unless the exact config changed into late 92 and early 93... but there's bugger all trace of this system to follow.

Anyway, I know where everything is now to put "A" multimedia 386 together, but not sure how close it is to what shipped, if anything shipped, and if reviewed one was closer or further from what shipped.... so I'll just say I "shipped" that CDROM and speakers together with my AST and call it good I guess 🤣 ... still messing around with TurboXT and PB-900 286 and got a 6x86MX making puppy eyes at me, so IDK when this one gets it's turn on the bench with what I've got here.

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 8 of 8, by Intel486dx33

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I think IBM and AST were among the first to Mass produce the “MultiMedia PC” for the Public
Back in 1993.
IBM had the 486 PS/1 Multimedia edition.
IBM PS/1 Multimedia ( max restore ).

AST had the 486 Bravo Multimedia edition
AST Bravo LC2 4/33s (486) Multimedia computer ( 1993 )

The IBM came with a sound blaster pro CT-2950
Panasonic 2x CDROM
486dx-50
4mb RAM
64kb motherboard cache
Onboard video 1mb

The AST Bravo came with
486dx-33
64kb motherboard cache
2x Sony CDROM
Media Vision PAS 16 sound card
4mb RAM
Onboard video 1mb

Both have Proprietary motherboards.

And both are NOT very good.

I suggest you build one from scratch
Find a good motherboard.
Get a fast 32x or 52x CDROM
16mb of RAM or 32mb. 15ns
256kb of motherboard cache is enough
Get the Fastest CPU