VOGONS


First post, by Strahssis

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Hey guys,

I recently built a retro gaming PC targeting the late 90s and early 2000s era. I used the following build for my PC:
CPU: Intel Celeron SL68C 1.70GHz/128KB/400MHz Socket 478
RAM: 256MB Samsung DDR1-266MHz PC2100U
256MB IBM DDR1-266MHz PC2100U
HDD: Transcend Standard 16GB CF-Card 133x in CF2IDE Adapter
Drives: CD-RW + DVD + 1,44MB Floppy Drive
PSU: Inter-Tech SL500A ATX 500W
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-8SIML mATX Socket 478
GPU: AOpen MX4000-V64 NVIDIA GeForce 4 MX4000 64MB
Sound Card: CMI8738 C3DX HSP56 5.1
Network Card: Generic 56K Modem Card
CPU-Cooler: AVC 117160 Socket 478
Case: Packard Bell iMedia 3733VL mATX

After I built it I installed Windows 98SE and it installed just fine. However, I'm running into some issues when installing the drivers. There are three devices that are not yet installed after a clean install:
NVIDIA GeForce MX4000
C-Media CMI8738
Realtek RTL8139A (Onboard)

I honestly expected there to be more drivers left to install, but only these three apparently. Even the USB-ports work in the clean install.

When installing the NVIDIA GeForce 4 MX4000 I used Forceware version 81.98. It appears to install just fine, but when I try to reboot I get a protection error and Windows tells me to reboot my machine. I'm only able to access safe mode and editing the MaxPhysPage-line doesn't make any difference. I also tried this doing this proces with only 256MB of RAM installed, but also then, I get the same error. I also tried using a different Forceware version; version 56.64. Again, it appears to install just fine. When rebooting however, I don't get a protection error, but the PC freezes at the Windows 98 boot screen and the PC makes an endless beep. This time I couldn't access safe mode either, because it also froze and beeped endlessly.

When installing the C-Media CMI8738 and the Realtek RTL8139A it also appears to install just fine. However Windows fails to actually use the devices after reboot. Windows will try to boot, but it will try and fail to boot two times. Then it boots up and turns of the devices I just installed. The device manager properties claims that Windows was unable to boot using the devices, so it stopped trying to use them.

I also tried using Windows ME instead of Windows 98SE out of despair, but I get the same results there. I could try Windows 2000 or Windows XP, but I honestly really don't want to do that as that way I will lose the ability to use my sound card in DOS-games. Does anyone of you guys know how to fix this issue? I'm looking forward to hearing from you soon,

Sincerely,

Miko, Strahssis

Last edited by Strahssis on 2018-10-12, 22:18. Edited 1 time in total.

Mimi: AMD K6-2/266, S3 Trio64, Diamond Monster 3D II, Sound Blaster CT2800, 32MB RAM
Satellite 220CS: Pentium 133, SVGA DSTN, Sound Blaster Pro, 64MB RAM
Contura 420CX: 486DX4 75, VGA TFT, Roland Serial MIDI, 16MB RAM

Reply 2 of 14, by Strahssis

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Thank you for your reply. I have already tried that by now. The chipset drivers install and work just fine. However, it doesn't seem to make any difference when installing the GeForce drivers or the others unfortunately; I still get the same errors.

Mimi: AMD K6-2/266, S3 Trio64, Diamond Monster 3D II, Sound Blaster CT2800, 32MB RAM
Satellite 220CS: Pentium 133, SVGA DSTN, Sound Blaster Pro, 64MB RAM
Contura 420CX: 486DX4 75, VGA TFT, Roland Serial MIDI, 16MB RAM

Reply 3 of 14, by KCompRoom2000

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My nVidia driver of choice for 9x builds with Geforce4 video cards is 45.23, maybe it'd be worth trying that to see if it works?

I don't really know how to help you with the other drivers, but all I can say is perhaps try different driver versions for your sound and network cards.

Reply 4 of 14, by Strahssis

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Thank you for your reply. Version 45.23 of the driver was released before the GeForce 4 MX4000 was released, so this version will most likely not support my graphics card, correct me if I'm wrong. I've tried all NVIDIA driver versions that support the MX4000 by now. With different results, but no matter what version I use, the PC will never boot when the driver is installed.

I've also tried multiple driver versions for my other hardware, but none of the installations have been successful, unfortunately. By now I have also tried to install all patches and updates for Windows 98SE, as I remember having driver issues with Windows XP once. The Windows Updates helped me resolve my driver installation issues back then. The updates installed just fine and everything worked. Unfortunately though, the updates didn't make any difference when installing the drivers; the same errors and crashes occurred.

I'm near giving up now. Maybe I should just buy different hardware or maybe I just have to use Windows XP or 2000 on this PC for the early 2000s only; I will push my 486DX4 to it's limits to play late 90's games then. I really don't want to give up though, but I'm out of ideas to fix this issues. Hopefully one of you guys can help me figure this out.

Mimi: AMD K6-2/266, S3 Trio64, Diamond Monster 3D II, Sound Blaster CT2800, 32MB RAM
Satellite 220CS: Pentium 133, SVGA DSTN, Sound Blaster Pro, 64MB RAM
Contura 420CX: 486DX4 75, VGA TFT, Roland Serial MIDI, 16MB RAM

Reply 5 of 14, by bjwil1991

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Did you disable the onboard video in the BIOS, set the default video to either PCI or AGP, and is the MX4000 a PCI card or AGP? What it also sounds like is a resource conflict somewhere causing the system to lock up for no reason. I'd suggest removing one card at a time, yet keep the video card installed, a 256MB RAM stick, and check and see what happens.

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Reply 6 of 14, by RetroBoogie

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If I remember correctly, 81.98 is horrible for Win98. Try 56.64 or 61.76. Trying to uninstall 81.98 should result in a BSOD, so try a fresh install with a different driver after you load the chipset drivers.

https://www.nvidia.com/object/win9x_archive.html

Reply 8 of 14, by Strahssis

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Thank you guys for your replies. I've jumped to Windows ME now as it looks like I'm getting some better results over there. (I can't believe I just said that.) Anyways, there appeared an IRQ-conflict between the onboard LAN-adapter and the CMI8738. Windows wouldn't let me change these IRQ-settings no matter what I tried, so I disabled the onboard LAN-adapter in the BIOS and now at least the CMI8738 works fine.

I've tried all your recommendations so far, as for the graphics card, but nothing had worked so far. I have tried every single graphics driver for the GeForce MX4000 by now; 56.64 causes the computer to freeze on the bootscreen after reboot, 61.76-71.84 results in a blank black screen after the bootscreen after reboot, 77.72-81.85 will give me a message after reboot that the setup is configuring my hardware, but it will never get pass that message and 81.98 destroys the OS completely. The BIOS is really shitty; I do not have a lot of options and there is no way to unlock the hidden BIOS-options. I did manage to set the "Plug & play boot options" to "External AGP". I think this setting disables the onboard SiS650 graphics. @bjwil1991 it's an AGP-card.

Mimi: AMD K6-2/266, S3 Trio64, Diamond Monster 3D II, Sound Blaster CT2800, 32MB RAM
Satellite 220CS: Pentium 133, SVGA DSTN, Sound Blaster Pro, 64MB RAM
Contura 420CX: 486DX4 75, VGA TFT, Roland Serial MIDI, 16MB RAM

Reply 9 of 14, by Strahssis

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I think I found the cause of the issue. The GeForce 4 MX4000 is an AGP-8X card, while the GA-8SIML only supports up to AGP-4X. Normally that wouldn't necessarily be a problem, but when trying to find if the GeForce 4 MX4000 will work in AGP-4X mode, I found out that it only works in AGP-8X mode. Well, I concluded that pretty much as I couldn't fine anything about it being able to run in AGP-4X mode. Usually if it works, it should be listed in the specifications, but with the Geforce 4 MX4000 only the AGP-8X mode is listed everywhere.

Before I found out about this, I tried disabling the hardware acceleration option for the graphics card in Windows ME. Though this would fix the freezes and black screens on boot-up, this still didn't fix my problem, as I was getting a protection error every time with driver version 71.84 and lower and with driver version 77.72 and up the OS would crash during boot-up.

Because of this I ordered some new parts and will change some other unnecessary parts as well now I'm ordering and rebuilding anyways. The new build will be the following:
CPU: Intel Pentium 4 SL68R 2.0GHz/512KB/400MHz Socket 478
RAM: 256MB Samsung DDR1-266MHz PC2100U
128MB Samsung DDR1-266MHz PC2100U
HDD: Transcend Standard 16GB CF-Card 133x in CF2IDE Adapter
Drives: CD-RW + DVD + 1,44MB Floppy Drive
PSU: Inter-Tech SL500A ATX 500W
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-8SIML mATX Socket 478
GPU: ATI Rage 128 Pro 32MB AGP-4X
Sound Card: Sweex CMI8738 C3DX HSP56 5.1 PCI
Network Card: 3Com 3C905CX-TXM PCI 10/100MBit LAN
CPU-Cooler: AVC 117160 Socket 478
Case: Packard Bell iMedia 3733VL mATX

Let's find out later whether this solves my issues or not.

Mimi: AMD K6-2/266, S3 Trio64, Diamond Monster 3D II, Sound Blaster CT2800, 32MB RAM
Satellite 220CS: Pentium 133, SVGA DSTN, Sound Blaster Pro, 64MB RAM
Contura 420CX: 486DX4 75, VGA TFT, Roland Serial MIDI, 16MB RAM

Reply 10 of 14, by Strahssis

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Hi guys,

I have rebuild my PC by now and I am happy to tell you that both the network card and the graphics card are working right now. However the sound card stopped working now unfortunately.

I used the same drivers that worked for me previously with my original build on Windows 98 & ME. I tried using both Windows 98 & ME, but I get the same result with either of them. During the driver installation Windows freezes up and later crashes entirely. If I use Windows New Hardware Wizard the system fails during the last part of the installation and if I use C-Media's setup utility the driver seems to install just fine. After reboot however, the system fails when Windows is installing the new hardware. The system then crashes and reboots without using the sound card driver (Code 11).

There seems to be no IRQ-conflict and the onboard Audio, graphics, network and modem device have been disabled. The only difference with my previous build sound-wise is that I installed a CD-audio cable; could that be a problem? Other than that I have no idea what could be the issue. I hope someone can help me and I'm looking forward to hearing from you soon,

Sincerely,

Miko, Strahssis

Mimi: AMD K6-2/266, S3 Trio64, Diamond Monster 3D II, Sound Blaster CT2800, 32MB RAM
Satellite 220CS: Pentium 133, SVGA DSTN, Sound Blaster Pro, 64MB RAM
Contura 420CX: 486DX4 75, VGA TFT, Roland Serial MIDI, 16MB RAM

Reply 11 of 14, by Strahssis

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Sacrificing the network adapter magically did the trick. There wasn't any IRQ-conflict however, but I'm happy that the PC is usable now though. 😀

Mimi: AMD K6-2/266, S3 Trio64, Diamond Monster 3D II, Sound Blaster CT2800, 32MB RAM
Satellite 220CS: Pentium 133, SVGA DSTN, Sound Blaster Pro, 64MB RAM
Contura 420CX: 486DX4 75, VGA TFT, Roland Serial MIDI, 16MB RAM

Reply 12 of 14, by Buma84

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Hi there. This forum board seems likely to be an eldorado for vintage computing marketplace enthusiasts. 😀 I just felt free to join in.

To contribute in your concern I ask though half a year since past: The MoBo shows it rev. 1(.1) or rev. 2?

For the GA-8SIML it was at first sight an OEM designed board for medium-sized machine builders. The rev.1 and 1.1 was a custom-built version with no capability even to modify the BIOS, so it doesn't feature even a CLEAR CMOS jumper. It probably could be designed limited to work with special adaptor cards only. This was once a matter of cost-effectiveness and twice to keep up the marketing mystery (... or service subscription with the OEM 😈 ).

In this case I hold it a most senseless histories fiddling around with, sorry for bringing spirits down. Better chances could arise out of the more rare Rev.2 board from which I truly know it was used in assembling early 2ks PCs by BLUECHIP, a german company located in Meuselwitz. https://www.bluechip.de/pcs/workstation/

GA-8SIML Rev. 2 is actual available from the eBay seller cbo-do https://www.ebay.de/usr/cbo-do . It is equipped with the functionality to CMOS flash several firmware, holden on GIGABYTE file server https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/GA-8SIML … support-dl-bios.

In case you should be interested in orignal paper manual GA-8SIML - for the real and unique retro feeling - fortunately I can provide you.

Reply 13 of 14, by RogellParadox

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Could it be the same case as mine?
I just finished setting my retro PC. I have a FIC VI39L mobo. It is stated it supports AGP 4x (so, no 8x at all), but since I bought the whole kit, ok, let's do it.
After installing W98 it's all okay. After that I tried to install the MX4000 drivers and, after restarting, my W98 simply freezes before even reaching the desktop.
Every time I use safe mode it works decently. Same for when I uninstall MX4000 drivers. But, anyway, I tried with two executables for these drivers. Fortunatelly I managed to delete those files responsible for Windows trying to install the driver every initialization. And, to finish, I did find info about MX4000 supporting both 4x/8x, but I don't really know what to believe.
The thing is: with the drivers, my PC freezes, without drivers, it works decently. So, what's the real deal? Can I run games or other things even without the drivers?

Reply 14 of 14, by Horun

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What driver version are you installing ? Some had major issues. Also that SIS chipset has Integrated SiS Real256 Video which could be causing conflicts versus a Intel 845P, 848P and 865P based with out built in video....

Hate posting a reply and then have to edit it because it made no sense 😁 First computer was an IBM 3270 workstation with CGA monitor. Stuff: https://archive.org/details/@horun