Jo22 wrote on 2024-05-29, 02:10:

pengan wrote on 2024-05-27, 20:19:

[..] I know this firsthand because I was also a digital dictionary gamer when I was a middle school student. here is part of that story: Chinese Dreams of Electric Words: https://chaoyangtrap.house/s02-episode-9-chin … electric-words/

Reminds me a bit of the 90s, when I was into collecting various calculators and elecronic organizers (aka electronic databases).

Technically, electronic dictionaries are electronic organizers with different software.

Ah, I recognize this face.

Jo22 wrote on 2024-05-29, 02:10:

Reminds me a bit of the 90s, when I was into collecting various calculators and elecronic organizers (aka electronic databases).

It would have been cool if the models sold in my country had featured a translator function, too.

the nostalgia! i remember those too, especially the cheap ones that appeared in the late 90's and through the early 2000's - the translators too. it seems so basic compared to what emerged in the late 2000's on smart phones.

in 2024 you can have an actual conversation in real time with someone who speaks another language with the smart phone acting as a translator, and doing reasonably well most of the time. that seems so far away from only 20 years ago, opening a phrase book and small electronic pocket translator

I see no reason to buy this over real vintage products, or just emulating. Perhaps it would've made more sense if it was a cheap kit-form project for the tinkerers.

If tinkering is what you want to do, original hardware seems more reasonable. For the rest, it's not historical and it's not like you have anything near a real XT machine in either look, feel or hardware anyway. Isn't emulating better then?

The whole thing confuses me. It doesn't seem like it's good for people who care about hardware or history and it doesn't seem like a good deal for people who just want to play games either.

As I see it, it's cheaply built crap that doesn't do anything special. If it attains classic status I'll be seriously shocked.

sheep wrote on 2024-05-29, 22:33:

It's not historical and it's not like you have anything near a real XT machine in either look, feel or hardware anyway.

This kind of mentality is why I'm a proud NuXT owner. I have no interest in dealing with failing hardware from that period, and I don't care in the slightest about "look or feel". Practicality is far more important to me.

DEAT wrote on 2024-05-29, 23:04:

sheep wrote on 2024-05-29, 22:33:

It's not historical and it's not like you have anything near a real XT machine in either look, feel or hardware anyway.

This kind of mentality is why I'm a proud NuXT owner. I have no interest in dealing with failing hardware from that period, and I don't care in the slightest about "look or feel". Practicality is far more important to me.

I have nothing against just wanting to access older software without caring about the hardware, feel or history. The point is that I don't see the value in the book 8088 in particular since it's such a compromised and expensive system.

sheep wrote on 2024-05-29, 22:33:

It's not historical and it's not like you have anything near a real XT machine in either look, feel or hardware anyway. The whole thing confuses me.

Hi there, I'm afraid I'm not very good at wording, but I'll try to summarize.

As far as I understand, the project has its origin in the model making scene.
In the morning lands, making models (funtional) of beloved vintage computers and other things is a hobby.

There are two directions, essentially. Western style computers and Japanese computers.
Personally, I've once seen an article of a miniature model of a Sharp MZ-80K.

And where the Book 8088 originates from, the AT type computers with VGA graphics had been sort of the introductionary platform. (The advent of DOS/V in the 90s had helped to establish DOS and AT PCs, too.)
Secondly, portable devices had been very popular in same place, too.

So as tribute to the past, it made sense to combine both things that people felt nostalgic for and make a handheld that resembles an iconic IBM PC: 4,77 MHz, 8088 and CGA.

The optional VGA card closes the gap to the PCs that had been so popular in the 90s.
With an NEC V20 installed, many DOS games with VGA (MCGA) graphics will run.

That's at least how I understand the situation, there are many fascinating PC/AT DOS games of the 90s from places like Korea or China I had never heard of before (like Crazy Hospital 1 & 2, Emerald Fantasy 2 or Sango Fighter 1 & 2 ? ; I'm just a layman here).

Knowing the background, the project makes much more sense.
For example, there's this ambition to develop a functional model that can be had fun with.
This aim deserves some respect, I think.

Normally, a model would be a miniature that looks authentic and has a little screen showing a boot screen or an emulation,
but it's not taken for granted that it has a working keyboard or is very compatible.

Under this aspect, I'm really surprised in a positive way and I see that it's not meant to rival the "real thing", even if it technically could. 🙂👍

Edit: I forgot to mention, in late 80s and early-mid 90s, 8088 based handhelds were popular DOS computers for "on the go".

Ie, the miniaturization in technology was good enough for making lightweight handhelds that ran DOS and were PC compatible.

Personally, the Poqet PC comes to mind. It has specs similar to Book 8088, including CGA graphics.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poqet_PC

So all in all, the Book 8088 has indeed an authentic link to the past.

Jo22 wrote on 2024-05-29, 23:55:

Personally, the Poqet PC comes to mind. It has specs similar to Book 8088, including CGA graphics. […]
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sheep wrote on 2024-05-29, 22:33:

It's not historical and it's not like you have anything near a real XT machine in either look, feel or hardware anyway. The whole thing confuses me.

Personally, the Poqet PC comes to mind. It has specs similar to Book 8088, including CGA graphics.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poqet_PC

So all in all, the Book 8088 has indeed an authentic link to the past.

You are right, it has more of a link to the past than I considered.

Still, for the person just out for some nostalgia, I think emulating makes more sense. For the tinkerer it seems better to go with original hardware or building something new.

I don't tell people how to have their fun but considering the book 8088 into classic territory seemed so wild to me that I had to say something

sheep wrote on 2024-05-30, 00:27:

I had to say something

Did you though?

badmojo wrote on 2024-05-30, 04:15:

sheep wrote on 2024-05-30, 00:27:

I had to say something

Did you though?

Yes. OP did ask for opinions. Go ahead and disagree but don't be like that.

Does the Pocket8086 actually have double the memory bandwidth of the 8088, even if peripheral bus is still 8 bit?

I was hoping to see someone had both and could post a benchmark.

Andys31337 wrote on 2024-06-11, 00:03:

Does the Pocket8086 actually have double the memory bandwidth of the 8088, even if peripheral bus is still 8 bit?

I was hoping to see someone had both and could post a benchmark.

I have both the book8088v2 and a pocket8086 (just arrived yesterday).. Gimme a benchmark to run and I'll run it. (The pocket8086 does have a V30 and 768K (including the UMBs)

sorphin wrote on 2024-06-11, 16:45:

I have both the book8088v2 and a pocket8086 (just arrived yesterday).. Gimme a benchmark to run and I'll run it. (The pocket8086 does have a V30 and 768K (including the UMBs)

Whatever you have handy is fine, its just for my curiosity. From memory, my book8088 came with some benchmark utils preinstalled..?

Andys31337 wrote on 2024-06-12, 08:47:

sorphin wrote on 2024-06-11, 16:45:

I have both the book8088v2 and a pocket8086 (just arrived yesterday).. Gimme a benchmark to run and I'll run it. (The pocket8086 does have a V30 and 768K (including the UMBs)

Whatever you have handy is fine, its just for my curiosity. From memory, my book8088 came with some benchmark utils preinstalled..?

Ok. I was just checking if you had any specific ones you wanted. I'll run something today.

Well, here's TopBench ran on both... (book8088 vs pocket8086 (book is slower).. both are running at their top speed.

sheep wrote on 2024-05-30, 00:27:

You are right, it has more of a link to the past than I considered. […]
Show full quote

Jo22 wrote on 2024-05-29, 23:55:

Personally, the Poqet PC comes to mind. It has specs similar to Book 8088, including CGA graphics. […]
Show full quote

sheep wrote on 2024-05-29, 22:33:

It's not historical and it's not like you have anything near a real XT machine in either look, feel or hardware anyway. The whole thing confuses me.

Personally, the Poqet PC comes to mind. It has specs similar to Book 8088, including CGA graphics.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poqet_PC

So all in all, the Book 8088 has indeed an authentic link to the past.

You are right, it has more of a link to the past than I considered.

Still, for the person just out for some nostalgia, I think emulating makes more sense. For the tinkerer it seems better to go with original hardware or building something new.

I don't tell people how to have their fun but considering the book 8088 into classic territory seemed so wild to me that I had to say something

People with "some nostalgia" will never go the distance to learn and setup emulators. If anything they will want to buy something off the shelf. Also ton of people who have nostalgia also have a productive working life and they might not have the TIME to setup emulators. Also which emulator does 8086 well? Not Dosbox. PCEMU and the other one are janky with input lag.

I believe if these hold up overtime (depends on the build quality which we might not be able to judge now) and if these are discontinued these would be Toshiba Libretto tier.

manmanbhoy wrote on 2024-06-14, 03:04:

People with "some nostalgia" will never go the distance to learn and setup emulators. If anything they will want to buy something off the shelf. Also ton of people who have nostalgia also have a productive working life and they might not have the TIME to setup emulators. Also which emulator does 8086 well? Not Dosbox. PCEMU and the other one are janky with input lag.

I believe if these hold up overtime (depends on the build quality which we might not be able to judge now) and if these are discontinued these would be Toshiba Libretto tier.

I fall into the category of, nostalgia (have the machines I grew up with and the ones there's no way i could have afforded back then) , I know how to set up emulators, I have no desire to use emulators for things, I do enough "virtual" stuff for day job stuff.. I'd rather use real hardware when possible, and honestly, I find people finding new approaches to making things neat. It's not for everyone. If you don't like something, you don't use it. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ As for things doing 8086, I've never seen anything myself. This is actually my first interaction with genuine 8086 (vs 8088).

So... lets summarize a bit here. I got a Book 8088 v2 VGA, and outside the BIOS update to v1.0.6, nothing else modded.

I'm assuming the following is needed:

• The LCD firmware needs updating to handle the VGA card.
• A timer line needs connecting (bodge wire?) to make it run the Area 5150 demo.

I have some hardware I can use to flash the new firmware on the LCD hardware, plus said firmware, just need some wiring info. I got a few Raspberry Pi's I can use to flash it.

Anyone with that wiring info, and what physical mods are needed?

STrRedWolf wrote on 2024-06-14, 13:58:

So... lets summarize a bit here. I got a Book 8088 v2 VGA, and outside the BIOS update to v1.0.6, nothing else modded. […]
Show full quote

So... lets summarize a bit here. I got a Book 8088 v2 VGA, and outside the BIOS update to v1.0.6, nothing else modded.

I'm assuming the following is needed:

• The LCD firmware needs updating to handle the VGA card.
• A timer line needs connecting (bodge wire?) to make it run the Area 5150 demo.

I have some hardware I can use to flash the new firmware on the LCD hardware, plus said firmware, just need some wiring info. I got a few Raspberry Pi's I can use to flash it.

Anyone with that wiring info, and what physical mods are needed?

If you contact your AliExpress seller, you'll hopefully find that they will send you a new LCD driver board FOC - there will be an updated firmware on the board.

I am having some interesting experiences with my Book8088 v2 😀
I have a PicoMEM board, and this is interesting because it feels like this is pushing the limits of this system. I'm actually wondering if the Parallel and Serial ports are taking up precious IRQ's that might be needed for the USB OTG system on the PicoMEM.
Anyhow.... some interesting questions. I have got VGA working in terms of 640x480 16-colours, and this works under windows. I'm trying to work out what I can expect under DOS though - I know that the CPU is going to be the limitation. But can I expect 320x240 256-colour or do I need to stick with 16 colour? It's hard to tell what I should be expecting and what limitations are due to the game engine.
Also, should there be any kind of OSD for the screen on the Book8088? Since I have the updated firmware I see the "VGA" mode in the corner, but the combo key from the Pocket 8086 does not function.

betamax80 wrote on 2024-06-20, 14:32:

I have a PicoMEM board, and this is interesting because it feels like this is pushing the limits of this system. I'm actually wondering if the Parallel and Serial ports are taking up precious IRQ's that might be needed for the USB OTG system on the PicoMEM.

There are some compatibility issues between Book8088's XT-IDE and PicoMEM, requiring additional setup can be found in the PicoMEM Wiki.
https://github.com/FreddyVRetro/ISA-PicoMEM/w … c-configuration