I am getting great results with a more modern laptop IDE drive. It's a Seagate Momentus 5400 60gb. The platter density on the newer drives from when Windows 98 was normal is much higher which leads to much better performance. Don't be afraid of a HDD. I wouldn't recommend CF. I haven't tried SD since I am very happy with the laptop drive.

I've used both CF and SD adapters on my IDE motherboard. (And a CF to SD adapter too. 😜)

I haven't seen many places selling CF cards these days, but Micro SDs will work just fine in a full size-size SD card adapter.

The limit for 98SE is 132GB, so I wouldn't exceed a 128GB drive.

If you choose SD instead of CF, a handy accessory is an extension ribbon: I use one to keep the SD Card outside of my case for easy access and swapping operating systems.

You can also use PassMark's ImageUSB program to create backups of the cards on a modern PC. 😉

I've used the StarTech IDE -> CF adapter, works fine
I've used some IDE -> SD card adapter thing I found on eBay, works just fine
Now I'm using the StarTech IDE -> SATA adapter attached to a Promise Ultra 133 TX2 with an SSD (80 wire IDE, of course) and it works just fine, even prior to driver installation for the TX2 in Win98SE.

The CF and SD adapters didn't need any kind of extra drivers and just worked out of the box. The SD card adapter is basically the generic thing you find when searching "ide to sd card adapter" on eBay with a 3d printed 3.5" tray for it I also got on eBay.

The CF and SD cards, especially the latter, made moving files really easy and making backups of the OS is as simple as "pull drive, attach to main PC and run imageusb, compress resulting BIN file, dump on NAS". The SSD will most likely last longer since it has some amount of wear leveling and garbage collection at a firmware level, which the SD and CF do not. I've got it attached, but not screwed down, to this sabrent 2.5" to 3.5" tray thing so while it isn't as easy to remove as the CF or SD, I can still quickly yank it if I need to make a backup or swap a newly imaged SSD in there.

Just be aware a full-fledged SSD is going to be severely throttled by the UDMA/33 IDE speeds so the difference between it and an externally mounted SD (A2 rated) may not be as noticeable. I probably could've kept using the SD card I had, but I have a bunch of 120GB ADATA SSDs lying around without anything to use them for.

CF is the 'easiest' for these systems since any adapter is basically a dummy that passes the IDE connection through, but the cards can be expensive per GB compared to the SD/SSD. Might be that Amazon tax, but a few places I poked into sell them new for like $1 USD per GB

Whatever you chose, keep it 128GB or under as I've had my 440BX board throw a fit on some larger drives. Didn't matter my 240GB SSD was formatted in half, Win98 and FreeDOS didn't like it when run on the hardware, even through the Promise IDE card. Also grab some of those Molex to Berg cables, the CF and SD adapters I've used/seen use those for power and you might not have a spare one if you're also using a floppy drive. The StarTech IDE->SATA adapter comes with a power cable attached, so you don't need to worry about that one. The SD card adapter might need a longer IDE cable due to how it connects to the adapter, but YMMV depending on where it gets mounted and where the board's IDE ports are.

ChrisTOTG wrote on 2022-09-21, 02:36:

Hi everyone, I’m building a PC based on an ABIT bx6 rev2 board, and I expect to run Win98se (and DOS7 when I don’t stay in Windo […]
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Hi everyone, I’m building a PC based on an ABIT bx6 rev2 board, and I expect to run Win98se (and DOS7 when I don’t stay in Windows).

I have an old IDE hard drive that should work, but I would rather go SSD if possible.

Research seems to show that I have a variety of options (IDE-CF adapters, IDE-SATA, assorted m.2 options, and plenty of examples of each)… so I’m looking for some experienced advice.

What products work best for sd -> ide? What about cf -> ide?

Sata ssd hdd, magnetic hdd for swap file, or no swap file. And ide cd rom. (Sata cd rom and 9x don’t get along)

I use a modern Samsung 870 EVO 256GB SATA drive with a SATA->IDE converter.

I have it partitioned into two partitions: ~20 GB for OS and utilities, and ~120 GB for games. Remainder of the drive is unpartitioned.

I used AOMEI Partition Assistant to partition and align the partitions on my Windows 10 machine, before transferring to my Win98 machine. I also disabled virtual memory on the Windows 98 machine. Since it's used only for gaming and has a half gigabyte of RAM, it runs just fine without virtual memory.

So far it's been running just fine with this setup.

Shponglefan wrote on 2022-09-21, 10:01:

I use a modern Samsung 870 EVO 256GB SATA drive with a SATA->IDE converter. […]
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I use a modern Samsung 870 EVO 256GB SATA drive with a SATA->IDE converter.

I have it partitioned into two partitions: ~20 GB for OS and utilities, and ~120 GB for games. Remainder of the drive is unpartitioned.

I used AOMEI Partition Assistant to partition and align the partitions on my Windows 10 machine, before transferring to my Win98 machine. I also disabled virtual memory on the Windows 98 machine. Since it's used only for gaming and has a half gigabyte of RAM, it runs just fine without virtual memory.

So far it's been running just fine with this setup.

Nice, this sounds about right for me. What converter are you using?

ChrisTOTG wrote on 2022-09-23, 21:29:

Nice, this sounds about right for me. What converter are you using?

This one from StarTech: https://www.startech.com/en-ca/hdd/ide2sat2

I use 80GB 7200rpm hard drive for DOS and Windows 98 and find it quite fast. 120GB PATA hard drives are very rare as many of them were produced with SATA connector. There is no need for an SSD for DOS or Windows 98 as games don't take much space and load fast.

Back then I had 13GB hard drive for Windows 98 and 60GB for early Windows XP period. 80GB is more than adequate for Windows 98.

AlexZ wrote on 2022-09-23, 22:41:

There is no need for an SSD for DOS or Windows 98 as games don't take much space and load fast.

Solid state is silent though. I prefer solid state drives for that reason alone.

Given choice of SSD or SD card I would go SSD. Both need proper use of a Trim util. Many prefer a real HD, no Trim as well as keeping things close to original in aspect what was in the old box.
I am of the latter group though have some CF and SSD in certain vintage boxes...
Never heard of using m.2 sdd (which is PCIe based) as an option in a PCI/AGP board, it must take a bunch of adapters to setup. Will have to look into that just for research...
added: Yes I know they make some SATA compliant...

Be warned, I have had nothing but trouble with ide to sata adapters on retro boards. And many others have as well. Though there are a few success stories.

Imo, best to get a actual sata controller card.

Most of my stuff is socket 7 and older though. Yours is newer may have a better chance?

Horun wrote on 2022-09-24, 02:04:

Given choice of SSD or SD card I would go SSD. Both need proper use of a Trim util. Many prefer a real HD, no Trim as well as ke […]
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Given choice of SSD or SD card I would go SSD. Both need proper use of a Trim util. Many prefer a real HD, no Trim as well as keeping things close to original in aspect what was in the old box.
I am of the latter group though have some CF and SSD in certain vintage boxes...
Never heard of using m.2 sdd (which is PCIe based) as an option in a PCI/AGP board, it must take a bunch of adapters to setup. Will have to look into that just for research...
added: Yes I know they make some SATA compliant...

Option a) I would go with Promise Ultra133 (PCI) + a Marvell (best) OR JMicron (second best) based IDE to SATA adapter + a SATA SSD

This combo :

- Supports disk > 137GB (if needed, Windows 98SE has a few limitations in this regard, but that's a different story)
- Works in UDMA modes even under plain DOS (including Windows 98 SE 's version of it) without loading any drivers
- Passes TRIM commands and works with rloew's DOS FAT32 TRIM utility
- Is fast and stable

Option b) Use original intergrated IDE controller + XTIDE BIOS on an ISA card * + Marvell (best) OR JMicron (second best) based IDE to SATA adapter + a SATA SSD

This combo :

- Works in UDMA modes in Windows 98 SE, BUT NOT under plain DOS (including Windows 98 SE 's version of it) unless one loads drivers that are not compatible with actual Windows 98 SE graphics mode (unstable)
- Passes TRIM commands and works with rloew's DOS FAT32 TRIM utility
- Is stable, but limited to UDMA33
- Supports disk > 137GB (if needed, Windows 98SE has a few limitations in this regard, but that's a different story) BUT this requires a patched ESDI506.PDR driver or modified Intel Application Accelerator . See Adding XT-IDE option ROM to Asus P3B-F BIOS [Thanks to DenizOezmen, it actually works!!!] for example of my experience doing this on another 440BX board .

* If you don't use XTIDE BIOS, you will be limited to whatever is the max disk size supported by your BIOS and if you can't integrate the XTIDE BIOS option ROM into your mainboard's BIOS, you can still use an ISA card (network card with ROM socket or dedicated card) to load it .

There are other options, but these are my favorites for a 440BX board, YMMV .

EDIT: Corrected typo

A pci sata card is an option also. It works in dos if that is where dos is. You may have to move the files there from a modern computer though.

Sphere478 wrote on 2022-09-24, 04:00:

A pci sata card is an option also. It works in dos if that is where dos is. You may have to move the files there from a modern computer though.

SIL3114 SATA cards don't support TRIM and Promise SATA cards cards don't always play nice with 440BX boards . If going with a mechanical (non SSD) SATA drive, the SIL3114 can be an option, if one can find a well made card that actually works .

Honestly with a modern SSD Trim support isn’t required, it’s nice to have but modern controllers on the SSD have excellent garbage collection and provisioning. So much so that even without Trim the SSD will likely outlast the system you put it in.

^edit: Nice, now that you say that, maybe it should have been in the drive all along 🤣.

darry wrote on 2022-09-24, 04:04:

Sphere478 wrote on 2022-09-24, 04:00:

A pci sata card is an option also. It works in dos if that is where dos is. You may have to move the files there from a modern computer though.

SIL3114 SATA cards don't support TRIM and Promise SATA cards cards don't always play nice with 440BX boards . If going with a mechanical (non SSD) SATA drive, the SIL3114 can be an option, if one can find a well made card that actually works .

I've been using the promise tx4 sata II 300 does that have trim? I haven't tried it on a 440bx though. sorry, if that doesn't help. I use it with Win ME on socket 7 stuff with SSDs

If you are not spending all day on this, producing PowerPoint decks, checking email, browsing the web and thrashing the swap file then you do not need to be concerned about TRIM.

I find SD card adapters to be great, they have low seek time and great small file performance that offset the 25mb/s throughput limit of the controllers. And I believe the controller allows DMA mode if your system supports it. For Windows 98 performance seems excellent to me. In XP the 25mb limit becomes more noticeable. A big caveat with these, they don’t work usually if you have a slave device on the channel so expect to use them solo.

Contrast to CF, not all cards support DMA and while sequential reads outpace SD, the 4k small file performance of the SD in real world usage keeps things peppy. See benchmarks at 3 minute mark here: https://youtu.be/Yn9vwOf19XE They have no issues with slave devices on the same channel which is a plus. But every day the supply of good CF cards is getting worse so if you’re buying new cards, it’s not really worth the cost.

The best overall will be SATA to IDE adapters. For SSDs, performance is good, better garbage collection generally and they’ll all support DMA. Good if you want to install XP side by side. But they’re a bit clunky, costs are slightly higher for the combination of both, and you can’t use them on laptops.

I’m summary, be like me and have multiple of each on the ready for each situation 🤣.