Polaris iPB-T came in... haven't had time to test it but the caps don't look great...

BetaC wrote on 2024-05-08, 05:22:

Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning. IMG_3394.jpg I don't really have a place to put it yet, but […]
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Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning.
IMG_3394.jpg
I don't really have a place to put it yet, but I'm sure it'll find its way in to something at some point. The more interesting find was the PPro board, complete with a 200/256k processor. I'll probably throw it in to my ATX case and do, uh, something with it.
IMG_3391.jpg

Just guessing it looks like an intel or Dell mainboard.
makes me suspicious about the power connector pinout.
Verify the pinout before attaching power.

weedeewee wrote on 2024-05-08, 10:01:

Just guessing it looks like an intel or Dell mainboard. makes me suspicious about the power connector pinout. Verify the pinout […]
Show full quote

BetaC wrote on 2024-05-08, 05:22:

Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning. IMG_3394.jpg I don't really have a place to put it yet, but […]
Show full quote

Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning.
IMG_3394.jpg
I don't really have a place to put it yet, but I'm sure it'll find its way in to something at some point. The more interesting find was the PPro board, complete with a 200/256k processor. I'll probably throw it in to my ATX case and do, uh, something with it.
IMG_3391.jpg

Just guessing it looks like an intel or Dell mainboard.
makes me suspicious about the power connector pinout.
Verify the pinout before attaching power.

Think its a Gateway OEM version of the Intel VS440FX (Venus) - https://theretroweb.com/motherboards/s/intel-vs440fx-venus

BetaC wrote on 2024-05-08, 05:22:

Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning.

By careful when manipulating that (beautiful) thing. Stay grounded at all time and wear insulating gloves. Blue lightning are the worst: https://www.essearth.com/what-is-a-lightning- … -from-the-blue/

BetaC wrote on 2024-05-08, 05:22:

Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning.
IMG_3394.jpg

Has it been remarked or something?

H3nrik V! wrote on 2024-05-08, 12:50:

BetaC wrote on 2024-05-08, 05:22:

Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning.
IMG_3394.jpg

Has it been remarked or something?

It's a DX2-66 remarked as a DX2-50

weedeewee wrote on 2024-05-08, 10:01:

Just guessing it looks like an intel or Dell mainboard. makes me suspicious about the power connector pinout. Verify the pinout […]
Show full quote

BetaC wrote on 2024-05-08, 05:22:

Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning. IMG_3394.jpg I don't really have a place to put it yet, but […]
Show full quote

Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning.
IMG_3394.jpg
I don't really have a place to put it yet, but I'm sure it'll find its way in to something at some point. The more interesting find was the PPro board, complete with a 200/256k processor. I'll probably throw it in to my ATX case and do, uh, something with it.
IMG_3391.jpg

Just guessing it looks like an intel or Dell mainboard.
makes me suspicious about the power connector pinout.
Verify the pinout before attaching power.

I have previously powered it using a modern PSU, and it didn't have any problems. I also forgot to mention that it came with an impressive 128MB of, strangely, RAM with a sticker saying it's for Apple computers. I know EDO/FPM is universal, but it's juts kind of funny to see.

PC Hoarder Patrol wrote on 2024-05-08, 10:48:

weedeewee wrote on 2024-05-08, 10:01:

Just guessing it looks like an intel or Dell mainboard. makes me suspicious about the power connector pinout. Verify the pinout […]
Show full quote

BetaC wrote on 2024-05-08, 05:22:

Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning. IMG_3394.jpg I don't really have a place to put it yet, but […]
Show full quote

Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning.
IMG_3394.jpg
I don't really have a place to put it yet, but I'm sure it'll find its way in to something at some point. The more interesting find was the PPro board, complete with a 200/256k processor. I'll probably throw it in to my ATX case and do, uh, something with it.
IMG_3391.jpg

Just guessing it looks like an intel or Dell mainboard.
makes me suspicious about the power connector pinout.
Verify the pinout before attaching power.

Think its a Gateway OEM version of the Intel VS440FX (Venus) - https://theretroweb.com/motherboards/s/intel-vs440fx-venus

Thanks for the link, I'll use it when I get around to messing with the board.

mtest001 wrote on 2024-05-08, 12:13:

BetaC wrote on 2024-05-08, 05:22:

Today I grabbed two things. First was a cute little Blue Lightning.

By careful when manipulating that (beautiful) thing. Stay grounded at all time and wear insulating gloves. Blue lightning are the worst: https://www.essearth.com/what-is-a-lightning- … -from-the-blue/

I don't think I'll need to much protection. I mean it is just an apparently rebadged rebadge of a cyrix part. Now, I will be more careful around my true Blue Lightning.

Well, kinda true blue. It's just a 486 SLC3.

Bought low 1.3V capable Slot1 motherboard with RGB 😀
...as untested. Sadly it has typical metal scrapers processing flaw - someone with screwdrivers forcefully removed chipset sink. Well result is obvious... ...not working and I do not have skills to repair it.
Quick probing result - at least +5v rail is shorted.

Oh well at least it can be scavenged for parts.

vutt wrote on 2024-05-08, 17:47:

Bought low 1.3V capable Slot1 motherboard with RGB :) ...as untested. Sadly it has typical metal scrapers processing flaw - some […]
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Bought low 1.3V capable Slot1 motherboard with RGB 😀
...as untested. Sadly it has typical metal scrapers processing flaw - someone with screwdrivers forcefully removed chipset sink. Well result is obvious... ...not working and I do not have skills to repair it.
Quick probing result - at least +5v rail is shorted.

Oh well at least it can be scavenged for parts.

Oh man, that's sad. I hate hate hate what people do to this stuff.

*pressure building*

*rant mode engaged*

I have to constantly remind myself that I used to do a lot more stupid things without doing *any research* first... and then, I remember that's because I was a dumb kid and I didn't have the internet! I just can't imagine what the mental process is when grown adults that presumably value a few dollars enough to have a side-hustle of selling junk (as opposed to people who can afford to just throw everything away) spend their valuable time to destroy things so that they can sell those things to other people who will spend their valuable time to destroy them further, hoping to get enough precious metals out of them to make it worth the materials and time.

... all the while, no one spends their valuable time to just do some searches for the names on the devices, or retro\vintage computer value. Retro computing has been very popular for at least 10 years and the value of things has exploded. If someone is really curious, they can look for a screen-printed name on a board, type it into an ebay search and then jump for joy when they realize the stupid board they were going to snap in half regularly sells for $50-$80 untested.

Here's an idea: If you come up with a box of scrap, don't know anything about computers and don't want to do any research on individual items, LEAVE THEM INTACT, then list the lot with good pictures for a price much higher than scrap value while accepting offers. If people buy it outright, great! If people say "hey, I can pay X amount, but can you put some packaging in the box so they don't get totally mangled." tell them you can do it for whatever amount of money makes it worth your time. If it doesn't sell, lower the price and relist it.

No time wasted destroying stuff and no blood shed from tearing at pointy metal things for hours with pliers and screwdrivers.

As a side note: It's sad how uneducated people still are about this stuff. Half the results on Google involving old computer parts being valuable are wrong, telling people to only look for a Gravis Ultrasound or Sound Blaster... or just flat out saying no, they aren't. I think back 2-3 years to a Linus Tech Tips video (I don't watch him anymore for whatever reason, I forgot) where he was in some guy's house who wanted a new PC built or something, and the guy had a HUGE collection of well organized vintage hardware, with shelves full of mid-90s motherboards and probably a lot more. Linus was just ragging on him for being a hoarder, like he had some kind of problem for keeping junk laying around. Durr... Linus, not everyone can make a stupid face for a thumbnail and blabber about something with only half the needed information while raking in tens of thousands of dollars per video. Some people collect things because they enjoy them and understand their usefulness and value.

*pressure dropping*

*rant mode disengaged*

... where am I? Oh look, old motherboards... ahh... 😀

After being bombarded with CRT videos on YouTube, I couldn't take it any longer and "treated" myself to this - my first CRT monitor, which I got for a very reasonable 15€ + 40€ shipping. It's a generic 19" monitor with mediocre sharpness, but the tube is still nice and bright. And I have to say, this was the missing piece that made games actually fun to play, everything about the hype is true. The perception of depth is what struck me the most, it almost feels as if looking into a window and watching the game happen inside.

asdf53 wrote on 2024-05-09, 04:41:

After being bombarded with CRT videos on YouTube, I couldn't take it any longer and "treated" myself to this - my first CRT monitor, which I got for a very reasonable 15€ + 40€ shipping. It's a generic 19" monitor with mediocre sharpness, but the tube is still nice and bright. And I have to say, this was the missing piece that made games actually fun to play, everything about the hype is true. The perception of depth is what struck me the most, it almost feels as if looking into a window and watching the game happen inside.
IMG_20240503_132046_2.jpg
IMG_20240507_075845_2.jpg

Its far more than just the depth, its how CRTs render images to the screen. You can hide a whole multitude of rendering sins with a CRT, its a very forgiving method of rendering images to a screen.

Also you really dont want a super sharp CRT with retro stuff, it tends to make older games look awful, a bit of softness can produce a better quality gaming experience.

Trashbytes wrote on 2024-05-09, 04:46:

Also you really dont want a super sharp CRT with retro stuff, it tends to make older games look awful, a bit of softness can produce a better quality gaming experience.

That's definitely true. One thing I was really excited about was playing console games in true 240p resolution with scanlines, but to my surprise it looked pretty awful. Instead of nicely blending everything together, the scanlines seemed more to tear the picture apart, it was too crisp. Many of the CRT "softness" effects in games also didn't work.

asdf53 wrote on 2024-05-09, 04:57:

Trashbytes wrote on 2024-05-09, 04:46:

Also you really dont want a super sharp CRT with retro stuff, it tends to make older games look awful, a bit of softness can produce a better quality gaming experience.

That's definitely true. One thing I was really excited about was playing console games in true 240p resolution with scanlines, but to my surprise it looked pretty awful. Instead of nicely blending everything together, the scanlines seemed more to tear the picture apart, it was too crisp. Many of the CRT "softness" effects in games also didn't work.

Yeah a lot of the games and such made for the CRT era took into account how the CRT renders lines to the screen and also how CRTs can reproduce TRUE colours, so when you try to move that to modern LCDs or try to use emulation to recreate the CRT effect it tends to look awful or has a not quite right look to it. LCDs also dont reproduce true colour unless you are willing to shell out for super expensive professional panels or use OLED.

It one of the main reasons I still hold onto my Plasma TV, its the closest thing to a CRT in terms of true colour reproduction.

asdf53 wrote on 2024-05-09, 04:57:

Trashbytes wrote on 2024-05-09, 04:46:

Also you really dont want a super sharp CRT with retro stuff, it tends to make older games look awful, a bit of softness can produce a better quality gaming experience.

That's definitely true. One thing I was really excited about was playing console games in true 240p resolution with scanlines, but to my surprise it looked pretty awful. Instead of nicely blending everything together, the scanlines seemed more to tear the picture apart, it was too crisp. Many of the CRT "softness" effects in games also didn't work.

Some of the CRT effects will depend on what connection you're using. While composite is generally worse than s-video or component, some games used it to their advantage.

asdf53 wrote on 2024-05-09, 04:41:

After being bombarded with CRT videos on YouTube, I couldn't take it any longer and "treated" myself to this - my first CRT monitor, which I got for a very reasonable 15€ + 40€ shipping. It's a generic 19" monitor with mediocre sharpness, but the tube is still nice and bright. And I have to say, this was the missing piece that made games actually fun to play, everything about the hype is true. The perception of depth is what struck me the most, it almost feels as if looking into a window and watching the game happen inside.

The motion clarity of a CRT is definitely one of it's greatest strengths compared to all other modern display technologies because it is an "impulse" display rather than a "sample and hold" display like LCD and OLED.

This is a pretty comprehensive article on the subject:
https://blurbusters.com/blur-busters-law-amaz … ample-and-hold/

Be warned, once you realize how bad your non-CRT displays are at motion (regardless of refresh rate), you may find yourself researching expensive monitors with obscure strobing\BFI features.

Ozzuneoj wrote on 2024-05-09, 05:54:

The motion clarity of a CRT is definitely one of it's greatest strengths compared to all other modern display technologies becau […]
Show full quote

asdf53 wrote on 2024-05-09, 04:41:

After being bombarded with CRT videos on YouTube, I couldn't take it any longer and "treated" myself to this - my first CRT monitor, which I got for a very reasonable 15€ + 40€ shipping. It's a generic 19" monitor with mediocre sharpness, but the tube is still nice and bright. And I have to say, this was the missing piece that made games actually fun to play, everything about the hype is true. The perception of depth is what struck me the most, it almost feels as if looking into a window and watching the game happen inside.

The motion clarity of a CRT is definitely one of it's greatest strengths compared to all other modern display technologies because it is an "impulse" display rather than a "sample and hold" display like LCD and OLED.

This is a pretty comprehensive article on the subject:
https://blurbusters.com/blur-busters-law-amaz … ample-and-hold/

Be warned, once you realize how bad your non-CRT displays are at motion (regardless of refresh rate), you may find yourself researching expensive monitors with obscure strobing\BFI features.

Wait . .did you just send them down a very deep rabbit hole with nothing but wallet pain as a reward?

Trashbytes wrote on 2024-05-09, 05:59:

Ozzuneoj wrote on 2024-05-09, 05:54:

The motion clarity of a CRT is definitely one of it's greatest strengths compared to all other modern display technologies becau […]
Show full quote

asdf53 wrote on 2024-05-09, 04:41:

After being bombarded with CRT videos on YouTube, I couldn't take it any longer and "treated" myself to this - my first CRT monitor, which I got for a very reasonable 15€ + 40€ shipping. It's a generic 19" monitor with mediocre sharpness, but the tube is still nice and bright. And I have to say, this was the missing piece that made games actually fun to play, everything about the hype is true. The perception of depth is what struck me the most, it almost feels as if looking into a window and watching the game happen inside.

The motion clarity of a CRT is definitely one of it's greatest strengths compared to all other modern display technologies because it is an "impulse" display rather than a "sample and hold" display like LCD and OLED.

This is a pretty comprehensive article on the subject:
https://blurbusters.com/blur-busters-law-amaz … ample-and-hold/

Be warned, once you realize how bad your non-CRT displays are at motion (regardless of refresh rate), you may find yourself researching expensive monitors with obscure strobing\BFI features.

Wait . .did you just send them down a very deep rabbit hole with nothing but wallet pain as a reward?

No no no... There is mental pain as well, when you realize that there is currently no best display technology. And even the holy grail of "1000HZ" displays at 1000 fps will not help to eliminate blur on anything that isn't animating at 1000 fps. So, 2D animated games and anything retro will still only look clear in motion on a CRT, strobed LCD or OLED with BFI... And the only one of those that doesn't come with huge compromises is a CRT. Unless of course you count the lack of availability, long term supply issues, size, weight, relatively low resolutions, and degrading image quality over time...

Yeah.... I don't sleep anymore. It started in back in 2015 when I switched back to a CRT for gaming, then shortly after bought my first 120hz backlight strobing monitor (Benq XL2720Z). It was a huge downgrade in many areas but it was better than non strobed at the time.

🤣

@Ozzuneoj: I agree that CRT has the incredible motion clarity but today high resolution and refresh rate monitors with VA or IPS screens are better for modern use. I tried using 21" trinitron and went back to LCD, because
- drivers for screen are not available on modern x64 systems so you can't select resolution by default
- GPU does not have VGA anymore and adapters are mostly crap
- convergence problems (can be adjusted but its a lot of work)
- good true black but no black level details (can be adjusted but it costs)
- sharpness are good for movies and games but for internet and text it's worse than LCD
- max comfort resolution for text is only 1600x1200
- size can also be a problem

For retro - CRT only
For dialy use on modern PC - Gaming LCD

@informatyk
LCD requirements for modern systems:
1. True 10-bit color or higher to eliminate banding.
This spec is usually very hard to find as a lot of
monitors sold as 10-bit are really 8+2 and they rapidly
change the pixel color to emulate 10-bit. This causes
flickering.

2. Very quick pixel refresh rate or gray to gray response
time. This is not the same as the refresh rate that the
LCD driver board supports.

3. Very good actual contrast.

4. Excellent brightness

5. Either G-Sync or Freesync. variable refresh rates are the
bomb.

6. High refresh rate. 144Hz or higher.

For the ultimate movie viewing experience in an LCD, an Apple 5k retina display at real 5k is simply amazing. (The dumb Apple OS does not let you do this by default) Even the smaller and lower resolution retina laptop screens are crazy good for movie watching.

-------------------------

For LCD screens for use with retro systems / gaming, it is a whole lot better if you have a screen that has an excell not built-in scaler.

Some LCD monitors just suck really bad at this.

If you want a good all-around solution, a programmable external converter / scaler is really nice.

... also, I'm not seeing this mentioned, but without backlight strobing or black frame insertion no LCD or OLED can have good motion clarity to the human eye with currently available technology. This is a fact, and it isn't caused by the display, it is our eyes that do it.

Compare this test on a CRT vs anything else:
https://www.testufo.com/eyetracking#speed=-1