devius wrote on 2020-06-20, 20:54:

Tetrium wrote on 2020-06-20, 18:28:

Personally I wouldn't btw call a s775 retro unless it has AGP instead of PCI-E, but that is a whole other debate 😜

I wonder if we should start another "What is retro?" thread, but that one I would be scared of devolving into madness and chaos 😆

Of course it is. s775, even with PCI-E, is the natural home of WinXP, and XP is a valid retro rig as there are games that will play well there, that will not play well or at all on a modern rig. OTOH I doubt you could find a game that came out when Vista/core i5 were standard, that does not play on a modern rig.

A few quick pet peeves of mine (Ebay):
1. When you watch an item that is a bit on the expensive side, and after a while of not selling, the seller increases the price? 🤔😂
2. Items with one photo, no photo, or blurry photos and little to no description. The seller then does not respond to any questions.
3. Sellers that cancel your order with the reason "buyer requested to cancel order" when zero messages have been exchanged. They then go on to relist the same item for a much higher price 🤦‍♂️

NScaleTransitModels wrote on 2020-06-20, 21:38:

A few quick pet peeves of mine (Ebay):
3. Sellers that cancel your order with the reason "buyer requested to cancel order" when zero messages have been exchanged. They then go on to relist the same item for a much higher price 🤦‍♂️

^^^ yes have had that happen ! Relisted as a Buy now for higher price instead of low starting Bid.

I think socket 775 is getting close to vintage but is not really, not yet, is not even 10 years old since last boards. Was first released a few years before Win7 was released. I get that it was designed for XP, Vista and Win7 but that is not same as designed for Win9x, ME and XP like socket 478 (released same year as XP). I do think socket 478 are vintage. Just my opinion. fixed an typo on the year

Horun wrote on 2020-06-21, 01:27:

I do think socket 478 are vintage. Just my opinion.

478 is certainly vintage to some and I'm not going to judge. I set one up recently just because I had enough parts. It was without challenge so I didn't find it terribly stimulating so I haven't powered it up since. Pentium 3s offer some challenge so thats where I draw my own personal 'Retro PC' line.

I just upgraded someone to a Core 2 Duo with an SSD and Windows 10 so I don't think there's much argument for them being truly retro yet. But again, to each their own.

Well, it's a s775 with PCIe HD6850, 8 gb RAM (max) and Q9550. It comes down to this: do I need a modern PC to browse the net, listen to music, watch 720> videos on Youtube and very rarely play with the 8-10 years old games I have?
Because that's what I do.
I just don't want to spend money on a new computer that could be spent on retro hardware. 😉
I believe the platform itself is already retro. It was introduced in 2004 and had 5 successors already.
I'll hold onto this computer as long as I can use the Internet safely under Windows 7.

Miphee wrote on 2020-06-21, 04:47:

Well, it's a s775 with PCIe HD6850, 8 gb RAM (max) and Q9550. It comes down to this: do I need a modern PC to browse the net, li […]
Show full quote

Well, it's a s775 with PCIe HD6850, 8 gb RAM (max) and Q9550. It comes down to this: do I need a modern PC to browse the net, listen to music, watch 720> videos on Youtube and very rarely play with the 8-10 years old games I have?
Because that's what I do.
I just don't want to spend money on a new computer that could be spent on retro hardware. 😉
I believe the platform itself is already retro. It was introduced in 2004 and had 5 successors already.
I'll hold onto this computer as long as I can use the Internet safely under Windows 7.

And after that, you will likely still be able to get use out of it under Windows 10 or some flavour of Linux . I have given away several Core2 Quads, originally running Vista, then upgraded to Windows 7 and finally upgraded to Windows 10. All still see daily use .

Miphee wrote on 2020-06-21, 04:47:

Well, it's a s775 with PCIe HD6850, 8 gb RAM (max) and Q9550. It comes down to this: do I need a modern PC to browse the net, li […]
Show full quote

Well, it's a s775 with PCIe HD6850, 8 gb RAM (max) and Q9550. It comes down to this: do I need a modern PC to browse the net, listen to music, watch 720> videos on Youtube and very rarely play with the 8-10 years old games I have?
Because that's what I do.
I just don't want to spend money on a new computer that could be spent on retro hardware. 😉
I believe the platform itself is already retro. It was introduced in 2004 and had 5 successors already.
I'll hold onto this computer as long as I can use the Internet safely under Windows 7.

Totally understand !
I run a Nvidia based 775 with a Q9650 and XP+ Win7 and would not trade it for anything for running newer older stuff. Plays BF series games fantastically well. Also have a i7-8700K on a Z370 running Win7 but my real daily computer is that s775 that I use every day for nearly everything including most of the posts here. Just not need to upgrade and truly hate Win10......

I don't think S775 is retro, simply because it's too new. And even though the original Pentium could have been considered retro by 2005 standards, tech has aged much slower in the last 15 years. Most people would still be fine using a Core 2 Duo system with 8GB RAM and an SSD.

My backup system is a Dell Vostro 200 with an overclocked E7200, 4gb RAM, and GT 630. Whenever I want to laze around and watch movies on the connected 1080p screen, it's great for that.

I consider anything past Pentium 3/y2k to be the cutoff for "retro" (and i do debate the 1ghz p3s even). From 2001 onwards, i find more and more games will either work fine on modern systems, or have much improved sourceports/fan patches. The hardware itself? Too close to what we have now.

I guess its a personal thing but part of the fun building retro rigs for besides gaming is experiencing all the different hardware as it evolved, and past the Y2K point everything just...well starts to feel kinda like the current hardware we have now. I already have a nice self built gaming PC so..idk, i guess its like, i feel no need to go back to that in between of y2k and now

End of the 90s, is the end of my interest as far as "vintage" computing goes. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Horun wrote on 2020-06-21, 01:27:

^^^ yes have had that happen ! Relisted as a Buy now for higher price instead of low starting Bid.

For me, the guy accepted my offer, then cancelled the next day and relisted a week later for 3x the buy now price. 🤦‍♂️

Vintage-ness to me is more about the OS: what the hardware likely shipped with, and what it is capable of running. I'd consider Windows XP to be the biggest cutoff; everyone used it when I was growing up, it still has decent software compatibility, and I have a friend who still uses it as his primary OS 😛

So hardware-wise, that means two cutoffs:
1. 486 and earlier are very vintage
2. Pentium 1 - early Pentium 4 are kinda vintage
3. Mid P4 onwards are not vintage: I have a couple mid-2000s systems, but it's more fun tweaking them to run modern software/ web browsing than retro software IMO.

Now I do have a Dell Latitude C840 P4 laptop, with a "designed for Windows XP" sticker on the top, and a Windows 2000 COA on the bottom. 😂 That is probably my limit on what counts as vintage 🤣

NScaleTransitModels wrote on 2020-06-21, 08:53:

For me, the guy accepted my offer, then cancelled the next day and relisted a week later for 3x the buy now price. 🤦‍♂️

My guess is that he got some other messages inquiring about the item and thought it must be worth much more.

devius wrote on 2020-06-21, 08:58:

NScaleTransitModels wrote on 2020-06-21, 08:53:

For me, the guy accepted my offer, then cancelled the next day and relisted a week later for 3x the buy now price. 🤦‍♂️

My guess is that he got some other messages inquiring about the item and thought it must be worth much more.

That would fit in with the conjectured "seller psych profile" that I posted earlier . That seller probably is in no hurry to move product .
I am curious, though, was the item initially listed 3x below comparable listings ? It would explain, though still not justify, his behaviour (he should have done his homework before the first listing and not wasted people's time).

Little rant from me.

I've taken a break from hardware lately. Prices have gone ballistic locally, and I'm guessing that is in part due to COVID-19 and people having more free time to spend on their hobbies. Prices on new hardware is up too. Understandable, but still a bummer.

Instead I've been spending time on the software side of retro. Collecting and archiving. I've had good success finding copies of previously expensive commercial software that isn't archived online (or just old warez copies missing most of the content) at very reasonable prices (or free), and I am very thankful for that.

However, in the last couple of weeks I've ran into three different people with such software willing to let go of it with an ad on Gumtree, Facebook and similar. Upon messaging them and talking, they decide to jack up the price to stupid amounts. I don't want to lie to people - I tell them I collect and archive it for future generations and hobbyists to be able to access something that might otherwise be lost to time. As soon as they hear collect, it's like a switch goes off and something that was listed for $5-$30 is now worth $200+ in their eyes.

I've given up trying to reason with these people. Chances are they'll never sell it, I'll never buy it at that price and they will just hold onto it forever or it'll end up in landfill.

I try not to let it get to me, because the amount of people who have been overwhelmingly positive in wanting to have something they themselves likely have fond memories of and gone above anything I could have expected to get items to me has been incredible. But damn, the fact some people suddenly jack up the price 10x when they hear "collect" just frustrates me to no end.

Do I just have to make up bullshit to be able to buy items at their advertised price from some people? I hope not.

darry wrote on 2020-06-21, 13:57:

That would fit in with the conjectured "seller psych profile" that I posted earlier . That seller probably is in no hurry to move product .
I am curious, though, was the item initially listed 3x below comparable listings ? It would explain, though still not justify, his behaviour (he should have done his homework before the first listing and not wasted people's time).

Well then he must really not be in a hurry, because the original listing was still priced in the middle range of "486 systems that POST but aren't thoroughly tested". From my experience at least: I've gotten more than a couple 486 systems for much lower prices and in better condition. 🤣

(as revenge? 😛) I got the exact same model computer for roughly the same price, which ended up booting Windows out of the box despite being woefully underpacked 🤣

devius wrote on 2020-06-18, 16:24:

I also enjoy fixing stuff. It's part of the charm, although at least once I'd like to get one of those pristine-brand-new-looking-and-perfectly-working old computers that everyone else around here seems to be able to find 😆

This hits pretty close to home since I was into DOS-era stuff pretty early on (think before Ebay became Expensive-bay) but didn't have spending power of my own and never found anything in person. Then a couple years back, a used computer store (2 blocks down the street) let me have a Dell Dimension XPS 450: 486DX2-50, Number Nine VLB, 3.5/5.25 combo floppy drive, all for next to nothing. It was in near-mint condition and only needed a hard drive. 😳 So to those fellow vogoners who haven't found anything yet: keep your heads up, because Expensive-bay ain't everything. 🤣

NScaleTransitModels wrote on 2020-06-21, 22:43:

Well then he must really not be in a hurry, because the original listing was still priced in the middle range of "486 systems th […]
Show full quote

darry wrote on 2020-06-21, 13:57:

That would fit in with the conjectured "seller psych profile" that I posted earlier . That seller probably is in no hurry to move product .
I am curious, though, was the item initially listed 3x below comparable listings ? It would explain, though still not justify, his behaviour (he should have done his homework before the first listing and not wasted people's time).

Well then he must really not be in a hurry, because the original listing was still priced in the middle range of "486 systems that POST but aren't thoroughly tested". From my experience at least: I've gotten more than a couple 486 systems for much lower prices and in better condition. 🤣

(as revenge? 😛) I got the exact same model computer for roughly the same price, which ended up booting Windows out of the box despite being woefully underpacked 🤣

devius wrote on 2020-06-18, 16:24:

I also enjoy fixing stuff. It's part of the charm, although at least once I'd like to get one of those pristine-brand-new-looking-and-perfectly-working old computers that everyone else around here seems to be able to find 😆

This hits pretty close to home since I was into DOS-era stuff pretty early on (think before Ebay became Expensive-bay) but didn't have spending power of my own and never found anything in person. Then a couple years back, a used computer store (2 blocks down the street) let me have a Dell Dimension XPS 450: 486DX2-50, Number Nine VLB, 3.5/5.25 combo floppy drive, all for next to nothing. It was in near-mint condition and only needed a hard drive. 😳 So to those fellow vogoners who haven't found anything yet: keep your heads up, because Expensive-bay ain't everything. 🤣

How very true . Sadly, my local goodwill type places rarely have good stuff anymore. Old PCs don't seem to sell very well and end up at recyclers . There are still a few local spots with vintage stuff, but most of that is late Pentium 4 vintage, which is not very popular .

x0zm_ wrote on 2020-06-21, 22:38:

Little rant from me. […]
Show full quote

Little rant from me.

I've taken a break from hardware lately. Prices have gone ballistic locally, and I'm guessing that is in part due to COVID-19 and people having more free time to spend on their hobbies. Prices on new hardware is up too. Understandable, but still a bummer.

Instead I've been spending time on the software side of retro. Collecting and archiving. I've had good success finding copies of previously expensive commercial software that isn't archived online (or just old warez copies missing most of the content) at very reasonable prices (or free), and I am very thankful for that.

However, in the last couple of weeks I've ran into three different people with such software willing to let go of it with an ad on Gumtree, Facebook and similar. Upon messaging them and talking, they decide to jack up the price to stupid amounts. I don't want to lie to people - I tell them I collect and archive it for future generations and hobbyists to be able to access something that might otherwise be lost to time. As soon as they hear collect, it's like a switch goes off and something that was listed for $5-$30 is now worth $200+ in their eyes.

I've given up trying to reason with these people. Chances are they'll never sell it, I'll never buy it at that price and they will just hold onto it forever or it'll end up in landfill.

I try not to let it get to me, because the amount of people who have been overwhelmingly positive in wanting to have something they themselves likely have fond memories of and gone above anything I could have expected to get items to me has been incredible. But damn, the fact some people suddenly jack up the price 10x when they hear "collect" just frustrates me to no end.

Do I just have to make up bullshit to be able to buy items at their advertised price from some people? I hope not.

Just don't tell them. Simple as that. Do they really need to know why you want to buy it?

x0zm_ wrote on 2020-06-21, 22:38:

I've given up trying to reason with these people. Chances are they'll never sell it, I'll never buy it at that price and they will just hold onto it forever or it'll end up in landfill.

that sounds exhausting, yeah, I'd just stop telling them as well.

interestingly I've had contrary experiences when I told I collect old hardware to preserve them, I've even had some people tell me the history connected to certain pieces of hardware, where and for what they had been used ^^

but then again, I buy most of my stuff on ebay without any communication beforehand, and I've had more experiences of being scammed outright on the local classifieds than in hundreds of ebay purchases.

cyclone3d wrote on 2020-06-21, 23:57:

Just don't tell them. Simple as that. Do they really need to know why you want to buy it?

I've found that it usually helps when trying to convince someone to post across the country when it's a pick up only listening on Gumtree. Straight up asking for postage on classifieds usually gets me ignored, providing the reason why I'd like it usually works, but occasionally just leads to the aforementioned price increase situation.

imi wrote on 2020-06-22, 00:19:

interestingly I've had contrary experiences when I told I collect old hardware to preserve them, I've even had some people tell me the history connected to certain pieces of hardware, where and for what they had been used ^^

That's the usual experience for me too. With one big lot of CAD software the owner was even able to dig up receipts and hardware specs for the computers they ran it on which was really cool.

darry wrote on 2020-06-21, 23:02:

How very true . Sadly, my local goodwill type places rarely have good stuff anymore. Old PCs don't seem to sell very well and end up at recyclers . There are still a few local spots with vintage stuff, but most of that is late Pentium 4 vintage, which is not very popular .

Yeah I've been to several local Goodwills and Salvation Army's over the years and haven't seen any computer equipment, new or old. A friend of mine used to have an impressive collection of picked monitors and TV's, but his mom made him donate it to Goodwill, who apparently scrapped everything. Might be some law I'm not aware of in California that prevents thrift shops from selling certain electronics 😕

Now on the other hand, used computer shops (at least in the SF Bay Area) can be goldmines. I've come across CRTs, P3s/P4s, an Amdek 386, even a XT clone... 😳

One local Salv Army outlet has had quite a few computers over the last year, mostly XP era stuff for sub $20 each but all the Goodwills in my area ship them to a Central location where they go up for bid on shopgoodwill.com (just another Ebay). Oregon and Washington, like Cali, has a recycle rule where ANY CRT donated to a non-profit must be recycled and not sold....so only place to find CRT monitors local is thru Craigslist. There are only a few local computer stores in this suburb of 2 million people, they have all gone out of business in the last decade. Last machine I bought local the original owner was very concerned what I was going to do with it, and answered honestly: going to make a game machine similar to what I had years ago. They sold me a nearly perfect soc 478 machine for $15 with all the original cd's. Just needed a new HD and yes am keeping it though do not really need it but the price was right ! So... it is what you tell them that sometimes is a benefit. If I ran into a bunch of old software for sale and they wanted to know what I was going to do with it: would ask them if they know about archive org, if they pressed would answer "a non-profit" that tries to save old software from the landfills. Am sure most would be happy to sell cheap based on that (and yes I am an Archive org memeber) 😁